Sessions with System & Soul

Soul Dive: You Can’t Lead Well Without Breathing Room

• Season 1 • Episode 26

Share episode

Most leaders don’t crash in a blaze of failure. They fade quietly, one decision at a time, as clarity drains and capacity shrinks. 

In this episode of Sessions with System & Soul, Benj Miller and McKenzie Decker explore leadership capacity. Not just productivity, but the mental clarity, relational energy, and strategic focus that fuel scalable growth, high-performance teams, and sustainable leadership. 

If you’re managing people, steering strategy, or feeling the friction of decision fatigue, this conversation is the reset you didn’t know you needed. 

Sessions is hosted by Benj Miller and McKenzie Decker

The best businesses aren’t just built on strategy, they’re built on soul.

If delegation is something you’re wrestling with, the System & Soul network has more than 50 certified coaches across the country ready to help founders and teams delegate with clarity and confidence.

📅 Join us LIVE every Friday on LinkedIn & YouTube

Your weekly leadership reminder.

Visit https://www.systemandsoul.com/261

Follow Sessions With System & Soul on LinkedIn & YouTube

Subscribe to our Newsletter!

Sponsored by Fist Bump

Hey, Mackenzie. Hey, Benj. Knock, knock. Who's there? Lettuce. Lettuce who let us get started today. We're doing a soul dive. And, uh, it's one of my favorites, leaving now. See you later. I get in trouble for all my dad jokes, but, uh, no, this is, this is gonna be awesome. This is gonna be awesome. So, um, this is, this is an oldie but a goodie. I don't know if we've ever talked about on here, but it has shaped my thinking for over a decade, probably 15, may, maybe longer, maybe coming up on 20 years. But it was, when I first read the Seven Habits of a Highly Effective Person. By Stephen Covey. It's a good book. Uh, there's seven Habits of Highly Effective People in the book. You've added some, I feel like you are like McKenzie. Yeah. There, there's the Nathan and Ninth. That's not the purpose of the episode. Um, uh, those are too long to talk about. Uh, 'cause you can mess 'em up if you don't get 'em right. But, uh, yes, I've added to it. Uh. Over time, but this is actually in the forward. What I wanna talk about is in the forward of the book, and either nobody read it or nobody understands it, or everybody forgets it because there's a, what I think is a profound insight that speaks into why these habits become effective for people, and it starts with this variable based equation. That Stephen Covey says is, is P over pc? And what he is talking about is our production or our output, what we're doing over our production capacity, and when we live in a world that idolizes production. How are you doing? I'm busy. Oh, great. Right? Like that's, that's what matters in our society. And so what do we do? We do everything we possibly can to be more productive. And so real life example, if you're like an eight productive. Your production capacity is a 10, then that's how the variable works. You'd be an eight out of 10. And if I come to you Mackenzie, and I'm like, Hey, I just, I need more out of you. I need you to get to a nine or a 10. All I'm doing, I might get more out of you. But I'm squeezing your margin. I'm eliminating any margin that you have in your life, and that's gonna lead a lead to burnout. And his point is, instead of us being so hyper fixated on production. We need to shift our mindset to what is our production capacity? And so can we change the 10 instead of changing the eight, what if we change the 10? What if we change the 10 to a 12? What if we actually more had more capacity to produce and then I go to Mackenzie and I say, Hey, I really need a little more out of you. And you go to a nine. You actually still have more margin than you had before at an eight out of 10.'cause now you're at a nine out of 12. So that's kind of the math of how this thinking works is instead of focusing so much on our production focus on our production capacity. Well, so how do you do that? There's a million ways we know them. We know that working out, you know, exercising, meditating. Uh, working on your own identity and how you show up at work, working on your communication skills, all of these things increase our production capacity. So I'm gonna pause there because there's actually, this is, this is where Stephen Covey takes it and after a decade of meditating on it, I want to take it a little further, but let me pause and get your reaction to that. You've heard it before, but I, here's the thing though. I'll say this to anyone who's a little brain scrambled, like binge said this to me. Five years ago, and I think I probably stared at you for, I, I don't know, this felt like a full minute before I, I'm like, what? Like it broke my brain and then it took me a really long time to understand it as a whole, like it really what I heard you say initially when I heard it five years ago, it, I was like. That's a really fancy way of saying get better and more efficient at your job. That's what I heard. I was like, yeah, okay, so the, the denominator gets bigger if I work harder, which is not what we're talking about, right? It's like working differently. Whether that's increasing your internal capacity for tension, anxiety, challenge. Whatever. It's like you're raising your, your ability to handle some of those things, and a lot of that is internal work. I think today as you were talking, I was like, I've always, once I understood it, I'm like, okay, so some of that is increasing internal capacity to, to really handle the weight of some of these things. Yeah, sure. But there's also, I think, and that we don't normally take this in this direction, but I'm gonna mention it like. The other thing that we have at our disposal now is our production capacity gets exponential with ai, with automation, and with some of the ways that we can think differently about how work gets done. Um, that's how I'm thinking about it right now with my team. Like we're having some of those conversations about how do I take the low value things that are taking up space in your production and your production capacity and turn it into something that you rarely ever. But it's still, you know, it's still producing. So anyway, that's my thought. My, my personal trainer just asked me this morning, he said, binge, why are all these CEOs, you know, can afford to hire me? Is basically what he's saying. Why are they all into technology? And like, all I could think in my head is because technology is leverage. Mm-hmm. Like, it's not 'cause we love tech, but if you shine a shiny object that gives. Somebody with this mentality leverage to increase that production capacity. They're all, they're all about it. Like, why wouldn't you be into that technology? So, uh, another way of thinking about it, and I, I see this as these, these circles, right? So we've got, our production is one circle and just outside that. Is our production capacity. And so yes, we're trying to expand our production to meet the outside of that production capacity, but we want to be expanding our production capacity faster. Ed Millet says, you know, when we think about. Time we go straight to a fixed mindset, a scarcity mindset. There's only so much, so something's gotta give. But if we go to the, almost these spheres and think about it expanding, then we move to an abundance mindset of how can we expand whatever resource it might be instead of being fixed on, on what we have. So this this abundance mindset, which goes to that next circle, there's one more circle. So if we think about. We've got our production, we've got our production capacity, our production's, what we're able to produce right now in life. Our production capacity is the maximum that we're able to produce in life right now. And then outside of that, somewhere we've got our potential capacity. And I do believe that all of us are wired a little different, um, different skills. Your, your potential capacity in one area. It's very different than my potential capacity in one area. There's some things that you are so incredible at doing that, you know, my capacity is so small, right? And, and vice versa, right? We're, we all are wired differently, but there is some, at some point, theoretically we can tap out our potential capacity, our production capacity can get to the point where there's really no more leverage. There's really no more growing it. And, and you see these guys are mostly like. You know, this is the 60, 70, 80-year-old and they've just grown to the point where, you know, they've got some aura about them and they've reached that state, sat in that for a couple years and that idea. And so what that means is that we've gotta really reimagine, again, abundance mentality, what is our potential capacity. But I realized that we're bigger than ourself. And so there's this thing outside of it, and I think the fourth ring is our purpose capacity. And so when we get really clear about our purpose, then it's no longer just about our own capacity, but how do we bring other people into that? How do we bring our creator into that? And it's, maybe it's the fourth ring or maybe it blows the whole paradigm because like the ring becomes so big, so infinite, so abundant. But there's something about people that operate. In their purpose with their purpose and in that purpose under a greater authority. That just seems absolutely limitless, and I love, I love having conversations about this because I think for people that are kind of trying to, you know, live their best life, not in a YOLO sort of way, but like what's the impact that I can leave here on this planet? This is a really fun conversation. I feel like we just need to give everybody a second to think on this. The, uh, and you're making me think of, well, I have two things. One is an example of what this looks like, I think in a company that I spoke with a CEO earlier this week, and the other is a question for you. Um, so don't let me forget my question, but I was meeting with the CEO and unintentionally he is talking about this. Um, their business is, I think it was $70 million business. They've just acquired a $20 million business, so they're bringing that team in. And the $20 million company, he's saying they went from, I think it was, you know, five to 10 to 20 in a, in a relatively short amount of time, but they, they got to 20 and they're like, like, it's like, what else? You know, like they had grown to this point where they're like, well, I guess we've reached our. In some sense, it sounded like we've reached our production capacity here with this business. Yeah. They didn't have, they didn't really have a purpose capacity in mind. Yeah. Yeah. And so they got, so the next logical step for them was to get acquired. Well, now they've got, we've got a $70 million company that's just brought them into the fold that has a very clear purpose capacity. And they are like, we're not trying to do what we did last year. We're not trying to do. 10% more next year. We have a very exponential mindset for where we're trying to go with this business and it changes how they do things. It changes. That's part of why they brought system and so in not to like, you know, brag about us, but that was his point was like companies that wanna do what they did this year in two years, or marginal difference. Yeah, it's not for you, but if you want, if you wanna reach that purpose capacity, it changes how you do things. How you think about getting things done, how you, it's the some, you always talk about the 10, the 10 x is easier than two x. It's 10 x thinking, not two x thinking, not thinking, how can I do more of what I'm doing today? It's thinking. How can I do something so different that it multiplies my outcome exponentially? So that's an example that I've seen inside of an organization. I think it totally changes the mindset and where they can go. I have a question though. And I think I'm remembering this from when we first talked about this, and I'm still feeling it a little bit, but I think when I try to talk about, when I try to think about this for myself as a human being in my, my capacities and all those rings, when I think about the capacity conversation with my team, I sometimes feel like there's fear. There's like fear of failure that lives between those rings, if that makes sense. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Like how, how do you address that with people? Because I think, yeah, I don't know. Let me just leave the question. Lemme leave it at that. Well, I've got an a answer that you're not gonna like because it's not tactical. So let me, let me just frame what's happening because fear and scarcity are the same thing, and abundance and love are the same thing. And so fear. You know, people think hate is the opposite of love, and it's not. It's fear and so it, the only way to get out of the fear is to find something that you love so much that it's worth, just screw the fear, I'm gonna do it anyway. The fear never goes away. But it's overpowered by the love, and I think that that's where the purpose comes in is because when you find that purpose, that thing that that drives you to do something bigger than yourself, then you're willing to risk things in order to get it. Hmm. Not very tactical, but I think that's the internal battle that's happening. Yeah. I think for, for us as individuals and for the teams and organizations we run, the question I think is. Is kind of what fear are we willing to set, set aside, and maybe what do we, if abundance, if abundance is real, then how do we move towards that more and more, you know, to grow that capacity. Yeah, yeah. You know, I don't, I don't think, um, if you're on the entrepreneurial journey, fear never goes away, right? Because once you conquer letter level 47 of fear. Guess what's next is level 48. Mm-hmm. And it is bigger and scarier, uh, and so you don't lose the fear. You just kind of get used to being able to walk into more and more and more of it. Um, and some people, some people can adapt to that faster than others, and some people are paralyzed by it. And you know, unfortunately people that are paralyzed. Uh, by it end up working three levels deep in a bureaucratic organization, and they're not on the entrepreneurial journey. Um, or, or they tap out like you said, Hey, like, we reached our vision, our purpose, and hit the 20 million and this was the time to, you know, hang it up and let somebody with a bigger vision. Let's go be part of somebody else's bigger vision. That's not a, that's not a loss. They did what they set out to do. That's awesome. Yeah, I mean, for us, I think what that looks like, if I think about our purpose capacity, we have this goal of impacting 25,000 companies by 2030, which is so big. It's like, I don't even know, 25,000. I don't know. I don't even know a thousand people, I don't think anymore. But like we, we set this, we have this purpose of impact because we have this deep belief that if we impact small businesses, if we impact these teams, it's gonna ripple out into these communities that they live in. Because that's the nature of, you know. Privately owned small and medium sized businesses, they just, they, they touch the community that they're in and the people around them in a very special way. So I think all of that, all of that is true at all times, and I think that keeps us in motion when it feels like our production, you know, it doesn't show up on the report or we're, we're, we run down a dead end road with something once again, you know, like there's like this. There's a frustration with the production or our capacity. That's one of my, I think that's one of the things I'm struggling with, even as we talk about this, this, I'm like, there's a production capacity that I feel, I'm like, I'm really feeling it in some ways for us, like marketing and sales strategy is a big one for me, where it's like, I don't feel like my capacity to do this is where it should be or needs to be. But I've gotta be thinking about if we're gonna get to that goal, I've gotta really be thinking all the time about, well, how do I increase my capacity, whether it's me or bringing in the right partner, or, you know, getting the right kind of strategy underway. But that's some of the ways that I'm, I'm kind of processing it for us. Do you have another take on that or more thoughts on it? No, I, I think, I mean, I could talk about it forever 'cause I'm passionate about it. But you nailed it. I think about. The, the number of companies and what that represents in terms of the number of employees and if, if we can create environments through those companies where those people feel. Dignified human cared for. Uh, they're in roles where they can contribute and they see their impact aligned to the purpose of the companies that they're in. They can go home at the end of the day into the week, more energized than when they showed up on Monday morning. They can then give to their family, breathe life into their family, breathe life into their community, their little league, whatever that is. Then the, the ripple effect. Of 25,000 companies is absolutely massive in terms of the uplift in people's energies that we get to, to speak into. And I want, I wanna see like this revolution in America of people that believe that the workplace is a place that where we can breathe life into people, not just use them for what we can manufacture. I think that's the question and challenge as we wrap up today is. Do you know your purpose capacity? Is it clear to you and is it clear to the team that you lead? I think so. I think it's two parts. I think there's a very tactical, how do I increase my production capacity? Um, which is, which is. Uh, really around, you know, there's lots of ways to do it. You can learn, uh, obviously we believe deeply in coaching, whether that's in a personal level or a team, senior leadership team, company level. Um, coaching I think is the greatest return on investment. Uh, but there's ways to, to grow our own production capacity. AI you mentioned. Um, and as we're doing that, go find our purpose capacity, because if we sit sometimes it's hard to sit down and find your. Anything purpose related, you tend to find it when you're in motion. When you're doing, doing the work, you're like, oh man, that, that was it. You kind of find it, discover it, not like sit down and, and journal it out. So that's my experience. Um, so don't wait for that purpose. Capacity to unlock. If you know it, claim it, go after it, but don't wait on it. Yeah. You can work right now on increasing your production capacity and. Go talk to your team. What do they need to increase their production capacity? Not just ask them for more production, but it's, it's how do I invest in you so that you have more to give? Not just the job, but remember part of that is also increasing your margin at the same time. That's huge. Yeah. And if you would like some help with that and you want some really like hands-on. Live learning time on how to increase production capacity for anyone on your team, and really having learning how to have a great conversation about naming that purpose, making it really clear, and really building it into the vision that you have in your organization. We're doing a workshop series right now, 90 minute workshops. Once, once a month-ish. So there's some space between 'em. These are live working sessions. So you're gonna show up with your pen and paper. We're gonna walk you through some of the system and soul tools that help really define some of the things that we talked about today and, um, for you and your team. So this is for leaders of any level and it's gonna really help you, um, find some. Common language and some really clear, simple ways to define some of the most important parts of your business, like what your purpose. Is, um, so we'll talk about that and we'll help you increase production and effectiveness with all your operations along the way. So we'll put the link in the show notes. You can sign up for those workshops. Um, we're doing them through the fall all the way in to January. So jump in if you can. Thank you to fist bumps again for bringing this episode live to all of you. And, um, Eng thanks for sharing. Thanks for bringing. This insight to me five years ago and now, you know, talking about it over and over in all these new ways has been profound for me. Thanks for not leaving when I started with the knock, knock joke. Never do it again. Okay, have a good day everyone.

Head Shot

Benj Miller

Host
Head Shot

McKenzie Decker

Host